Carbs and Visceral fat

stephintexas
on 7/10/12 12:03 pm

I lost 8" in my waist the first month or so after surgery. None since month 3. I went back through my spreadsheets and it seems that when I added in carbs, went off ketosis, I jumped the shark, so to speak. I have a disproportionate waist line. A few years back, I had several plastic surgeries with a reputable surgeon. He said he could lipo and do a tummy tuck for cosmetic reasons but I needed to also lose my "visceral fat." What's that?, I asked and he educated me. When you're overweight, your body stores fat internally too and this is bad. A woman with a waist over 35 has issues and concerns regarding health, early death, etc.

When I had my sleeve surgery, I asked to see the pics of the surgery. I looked like a fatty chicken on the inside. Gross!! So in the debate of low carbs versus normal carbs, my Nut seems to be off a bit.

In my carb withdrawal funk, I've been doing what all rational people do and googled. I found overhwelming data that low carb diets burn the visceral fat, as indicated by the loss of waist, more than other types of diets. This lines up with the data on my own spreadsheets.  So it's not JUST rapid weight loss to goal, it's where you lose weight that is influenced by carbs. There's also evidence that the initial period of weight loss, as the fat burns away from the organs and is absorbed, lots of water helps to flush the system. However, there will still be feelings of toxicity and general "ill" feeling as the fat breaks down and flushes out.

Seems worth it to not have a fatty liver or fat heart. So I will continue whining and moaning and drooling over carbs but I will quit them. I will do as I should have done at surgery and break up with carbs. I will say good bye and adieu and my organs will thank me.

Low-Carb Diet

Scientists at the Commonwealth Scientific and Industrial Research Organization-Human Nutrition in Australia studied the impact of a low-carb diet on weight loss and cardiovascular risk factors in subjects with abdominal obesity. They observed that participants following a very-low carb diet for eight weeks lost a greater amount of belly fat compared with those who adhered to a high-carb, low-fat diet, according to research reported in the March 2008 issue of the "The American Journal of Clinical Nutrition."



Read more: http://www.livestrong.com/article/522287-can-the-atkins-diet -help-you-lose-your-belly-fat-and-get-you-a-flat-stomach/#ix zz20FPLwdJh
        
hacnmac
on 7/10/12 12:33 pm - TN
Heart breaking but true!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Heather                 
(deactivated member)
on 7/10/12 12:35 pm - CA
VSG on 03/24/11 with
I just started my detox... Boo! I know I'm going to be a ***** for a few days. Hahahaha! My poor bf!
jubjub
on 7/10/12 1:23 pm - Eden Prairie, MN
VSG on 06/25/12 with
 Not that you need more evidence, but I just finished readed Gary Taubes excellent book, "Why We Get Fat" that goes through tons of research showing the same.

The book basically flips the obesity problem on its head.  Instead of saying "people get fat because they eat too many calories" it asks "WHY do people eat too many calories?" It seems like an obvious jump but the nutritional world (with some exceptions) failed to make it.

All you have to do is watch something like "Supersized vs. Superskinny" and see people at 500 lbs who have just given up trying to make you realize that this isn't just a problem of "eating too many calories."  The WHY in the face of certain disease, social ostracism, lack of mobility, etc. is critical to understand.  But go to most doctors or Nuts and they give you a "balanced" diet based on the food pyramid, which in my personal opinion was more the result of lobbying by various food industry groups than on any science.

In any case, you'll see in the book he makes a very strong case for exactly what you're saying.  The interesting thing, to me, is that low carb diets were successful 50 years ago.  But some influential people in the nutrition world changed that, declaring that fat was bad and carbs were good.  This reached a peak in the 80s.  Guess when our national obesity rates began to skyrocket?


Heaviest: 313/VSG Pre: 295/Surgery: 260/Maintenance range: 175 - 180

2014 Miles cycled so far: 3,657 / Goal: 7,000 miles

 

jubjub
on 7/10/12 1:25 pm - Eden Prairie, MN
VSG on 06/25/12 with
 Ooh, i would just like to add that everyone is different, and I truly believe you have to figure out how YOU respond to certain foods.  The general prescriptions to eat a certain way don't work for people with metabolic problems.  It seems we're mostly left to sort things out on our own.  That's a strong argument for tracking and learning from trying things.

Heaviest: 313/VSG Pre: 295/Surgery: 260/Maintenance range: 175 - 180

2014 Miles cycled so far: 3,657 / Goal: 7,000 miles

 

stephintexas
on 7/10/12 2:32 pm
I carry a lot of fat around my middle (you can see in my pics on my profile). Low carb has always worked for me but my doctor has fought me on it. He said "a site on the internet isn't a clinician and can't take the place of one" I think he misled me after surgery, albeit not on purpose. Someone here told me that with my food plan, I'd stop or slow down to a crawl at six months. They were wrong, it was at FOUR months! I love me some bread but not that much.
        
jubjub
on 7/10/12 3:17 pm - Eden Prairie, MN
VSG on 06/25/12 with

 I'm the same way.  The surgeon, post op, said "you have a LOT of visceral fat."  Which makes sense.  It's also a marker for people that process carbs poorly.  Which I am convinced, through self-experimentation, is true.

I guess I just do what I think is right and them have my blood / urine chemistry checked - if it and my weight are moving in the right direction, i find it hard to believe the dr. would be very critical.  If he is, oh well.  There are many doctors who agree with the low-carb hypothesis...  

Read the book, or if you don't have time, or interest, read this (very short, includes info on new research about low-carb diets): http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/01/opinion/sunday/what-really-makes-us-fat.html



Or this (longer, and was the start of Taubes' research for the book):

 http://www.nytimes.com/2002/07/07/magazine/what-if-it-s-all-been-a-big-fat-lie.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm

 

 

Heaviest: 313/VSG Pre: 295/Surgery: 260/Maintenance range: 175 - 180

2014 Miles cycled so far: 3,657 / Goal: 7,000 miles

 

stephintexas
on 7/10/12 8:28 pm
On July 10, 2012 at 3:17 PM Pacific Time, jubjub wrote:

 I'm the same way.  The surgeon, post op, said "you have a LOT of visceral fat."  Which makes sense.  It's also a marker for people that process carbs poorly.  Which I am convinced, through self-experimentation, is true.

I guess I just do what I think is right and them have my blood / urine chemistry checked - if it and my weight are moving in the right direction, i find it hard to believe the dr. would be very critical.  If he is, oh well.  There are many doctors who agree with the low-carb hypothesis...  

Read the book, or if you don't have time, or interest, read this (very short, includes info on new research about low-carb diets): http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/01/opinion/sunday/what-really-makes-us-fat.html



Or this (longer, and was the start of Taubes' research for the book):

 http://www.nytimes.com/2002/07/07/magazine/what-if-it-s-all-been-a-big-fat-lie.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm

 

 

I downloaded it on my nook. Im growing fascinated with the whole carb debate.
        
jubjub
on 7/11/12 2:03 pm - Eden Prairie, MN
VSG on 06/25/12 with
 please let me know what you think of it!

Heaviest: 313/VSG Pre: 295/Surgery: 260/Maintenance range: 175 - 180

2014 Miles cycled so far: 3,657 / Goal: 7,000 miles

 

Chalk
on 7/11/12 9:29 pm - TN
VSG on 01/09/12 with
I stated reading the Gary Taubes book after I read the NYT article. Truly fascinating and it makes so much sense to me.

I'm a retired home economics teacher who taught nutrition for 34 years. This book has turned everything I have learned and taught upside down.

Pre-Op Weight Loss 20 lbs ~~~~~ Surgery Weight 289

 Goal weight 180  ~~~~~~  6'0"

Month 1 (21 lbs) ~~~ Month 2 (10 lbs) ~~~ Month 3 (14 lbs) ~~~ Month 4 (12 lbs) ~~~ Month 5 (9 lbs) ~~~ Month 6 (11 lbs) ~~~ Month 7 (10 lbs) ~~~~ Month 8 (8 lbs) ~~~ Month 9 (9 lbs) ~~~ Month 10 (6 lbs)

Goal Reached in 10 months  

 

happiegirl
on 7/10/12 1:30 pm - Albuquerque, NM
VSG on 04/24/12
All true stuff! This is why they give you a low-carb liquid diet before surgery.  This is the dangerous kind of fat.  Not only size but genetics play in to this.  Some people naturally store fat on the inside, others not so much.  Some people don't store on the belly at all, instead they store fat on the legs/bottom.  That's all genetic.  This is why some thin people can still have all the risks that are associated with being obese, they have a great deal of internal fat.  High carb diets are good for anyone, because they are what cause fat to accumulate on the abdomen.  Fat or thin high carb diets aren't the way to go.

HW: 351 Pre-op: 272  Current: 140.7 Goal:160      M1:14 M2:14  M3:11  M4:10 M5:10  M6:12  M7:8  M8:6 M9: 6 M10:7 M11: 6 M12: 4 M13: 5 M14:7 M15: 4 M16: 3 M17: 1   M18: 4

 
"Glory lies in the attempt to reach one's goal and not in reaching it." - Gandhi
 

    

KathyA999
on 7/10/12 9:24 pm
VSG on 08/09/10 with
Both of Taubes' books are excellent!  I recommend another book too, The Art & Science of Low Carbohydrate Eating by Drs Volek and Phinney - essentially describes the how/why (to the degree science understands it so far) so many people respond to carbs by gaining weight, developing metabolic syndrome and Type II diabetes, etc.  One of the things that becomes clear in the book is that the toxicity and general ill feeling you describe is real, and lasts about 2-3 weeks as the body switches to burning fat for its fuel.

If for no other reason, get the book and check out Chapter 18, a summary of the main points.

Jubjub is right, Taubes traced back and discovered that our current reliance on grains as a staple of the American diet is based on the opinion - OPINION! - of a single very influential scientist, who decided, based on logic, that dietary fat equals fat in the body/blood/organs.  Study after study has failed to support that premise, and of course we know the body's processes are so much more complex than a simple equation.

Height - 5' 7"   High Wt 268 / Consult Wt 246 / Surgery Wt 241 / Goal Wt 150 / Happy place 135-137 / Current Wt 145
Tracker starts at consult weight       
                               
In maintenance since December 2011.
 

jubjub
on 7/11/12 2:07 pm - Eden Prairie, MN
VSG on 06/25/12 with
 Speaking of 2-3 weeks to switch over... it's been 16 days since I had surgery, and have been in Ketosis since that day, I believe.  I measure every couple days with a keto stick, mainly because I'm a nerd.  Today I feel great! So full of energy i can hardly stand still.  The previous two weeks were a bit up and down on energy level.  Some of that is probably post-surgery, but some or most was the keto switchover.  Ride it out and you shall be rewarded.  

Heaviest: 313/VSG Pre: 295/Surgery: 260/Maintenance range: 175 - 180

2014 Miles cycled so far: 3,657 / Goal: 7,000 miles

 

jubjub
on 7/11/12 10:50 pm - Eden Prairie, MN
VSG on 06/25/12 with
 Thanks for the book recommendation.  I downloaded it and read most of it on the plane (long delay in atlanta...) 

Heaviest: 313/VSG Pre: 295/Surgery: 260/Maintenance range: 175 - 180

2014 Miles cycled so far: 3,657 / Goal: 7,000 miles