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| Author | Message |
 Duodenal Switch (05/14/08) Member Since: 08/05/07[Latest Posts] | Post Date: 11/25/08 1:43 pm Had my six-month labs drawn last Thursday. Got a message from the NP at my surgeon's office early yesterday morning, advising me that my Vitamin D 25 Hydroxy level was 15, with the standard range being 30-80. The NP told me that she was going to fax a prescription to my pharmacy as soon as I messaged her about my Vitamin D intake. I sent her that info and she faxed the prescription over. About an hour later, the prescription was ready. I went over to the pharmacy to pick it up. When the pharmacy tech picked up my order, I asked him if the Vitamin D was oil-based or dry-based. He had no clue at all, so I told him to get the pharmacist for me and he did. I asked the pharmacist the same question. She said only that Vitamin D was in "gelcap" form. I had my suspicion that it was oil-based and explained to her that my Vitamin D had to be in dry form. She went back to look at the pharmaceutical info for the Vitamin D and the first ingredient was soybean oil. I asked her if she could get it in dry form and she said that the highest formulation for dry Vitamin D was only 1,000 and the 50K that I needed was only available in an oil-base. I refused the prescription and she said that she was going to call the NP to see if the NP has any other alternative. When I got home, I sent a message to the NP, advising her that I had refused the prescription because it contained soybean oil. She asked me if there was a reason that I could not take the 50K in soybean oil and also recommended that I take the Vitamin D that way. Otherwise, I could pick it up OTC and have to take too many pills a day. I responded that only about 20 percent of oils can be absorbed in our re-arranged intestines and didn't think that I would benefit from an oil-based Vitamin D. Plus, Dr. D requires that all vitamins for those with the DS be in dry form. Looks like I may have to order the Vitamin D thru Vitalady.com. I don't know if I should get the Vitalady Tender Dry or Biotech Dry Vitamin brand. I seem to recall a debate between Diana and Michelle on one of her vitamins a few months ago but don't know if Vitamin D was involved. Vicki  Has not weighed myself since 1/2010. Letting my clothes gauge my progress instead. |
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 Burlington County, NJ Duodenal Switch (12/04/06) Member Since: 11/11/02[Latest Posts] | Post Date: 11/25/08 1:57 pm It was....oh dang, I don't remember now what it was. Upcal D I think? It wasn't the vitamin D. Biotech and Vitalady brand are pretty much the same, D-3 as cholecalciferol. If I were in your shoes I'd take 100,000 IU daily until I hit the top end of the lab values. Mine bottomed out at 9. Three months of 100,000 IU daily got it to 27, six months got it to.....um, now I can't remember the exact number, but it was under 50. Might have even been under 40. I'll have to dig out my records and look. I'm about to have labs again at almost ten months of 100,000 IU daily. I've used both the Biotech and Vitalady's brand with no discernible difference in the results. |
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Duodenal Switch (05/14/08) Member Since: 08/05/07[Latest Posts] | Post Date: 11/26/08 12:03 am Elizabeth, I remember Diana posting about the UPCal-D, but I don't remember her and Michelle debating about that. I did review the info in my secure clinic account about the Vitamin D. Seems that the NP prescribed 50K to be taken only once weekly. It is very contrary to Michelle's recommendation that at least 50K of the dry form should be taken daily. Thanks for the info! And best of luck on your next labs! Vicki Has not weighed myself since 1/2010. Letting my clothes gauge my progress instead. |
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Burlington County, NJ Duodenal Switch (12/04/06) Member Since: 11/11/02[Latest Posts] | Post Date: 11/26/08 7:54 am Yeah, Michelle was involved in that subject too. The upshot was that she agreed Diana's right about the labeling being misleading at best, I think. Non-op's with D deficiencies usually take a weekly or twice weekly dose of D. We are very different, of course, and on this subject it's a good time to just smile and nod at the doc doing the prescribing and follow the course that is being shown by many DS'ers (and RNY'ers) experience to be what works. It's not like you're going to poison yourself.....not that anybody really knows what vitamin D toxicity is or how high your levels have to be or for how long to get it. Here's an interesting site about vitamin D: www.vitamindcouncil.org |
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Duodenal Switch (05/14/08) Member Since: 08/05/07[Latest Posts] | Post Date: 12/2/08 1:20 pm I clicked on the link that Ronnie provided. That posting was the reason I literally dumped my UPCal-D down the drain in my kitchen sink after less than a month and switched to the Vitamin Shoppe Calcium Citrate with Vitamin D. I was supplementing the UPCal-D with the BA calcium citrate. Now I take the BA and Vitamin Shoppe brands of calcium citrate. My calcium level was within the standard range at my most recent six-month labs. The Vitamin D Council link has very interesting info, and I have bookmarked it for future reference. Vicki Has not weighed myself since 1/2010. Letting my clothes gauge my progress instead. |
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Burlington County, NJ Duodenal Switch (12/04/06) Member Since: 11/11/02[Latest Posts] | Post Date: 12/2/08 6:27 pm What do you mean when you say your "calcium level"? You mean calcium as measured in your blood? That's virtually *never* going to be off, because of how tightly your body regulates the blood levels. You need to know how your PTH and/or calcitrol levels are, as well as all the vitamin D numbers. (There are three D values to check, I believe.) |
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 AL Duodenal Switch (07/16/08) Member Since: 07/24/07[Latest Posts] | Post Date: 11/26/08 10:57 am Vicki, I don't know if this is the post you were talking about from Michelle but I think it is so I'm going to paste it here along with the link to the thread. If its not what you were talking about just overlook me. Post Date: 5/26/08 10:15 pm Diana very kindly helped me word this to reflect the numbers accurately. Don and I have been working on this for awhile. We still use these products ourselves, and blood levels are perfect, and that's "my definition" of perfect. Don's completely out of osteoporosis and moving back almost to cross the line into good bones again. I've moved, but not as far.**********It has come to our attention, that we carry several calcium citrate products that have questionable label information. The products themselves have helped many customers stabilize their calcium levels and in some cases improver their T-Scores when bone density is monitored by DEXA scan. Nature’s Science Calcium with D & Magnesium; Calcium 750; SciFit Osteo Enhanced and Global Health UpCal D report calcium amounts as 500 or 750mg Calcium Citrate. These amounts refer to calcium salts and not elemental calcium. Elemental calcium is approx 1/4 of the total weight of the calcium salts. Therefore the 500 mg and 750 doses only contain about 125 mg and 190 mg elemental calcium citrate, respectively. The manufactures say that the label may be misunderstood, but fall into proper regulations for product labeling. The OR IGINAL UpCal D with the larger scoop an grittier formula was 500mg elemental calcium.We have been looking into higher dose calcium IN CAPSULE and/or powdered form. As these products have been recommended by many doctors and clinics we have elected to not remove the products from our shelves until we have an economical alternative.The real concern is in the results achieved in using these products. They have provided many customers with an easy to use, high quality calcium citrate at a acceptable price. The proof of effectiveness is in your test results. However, we want our product labels to reflect more accurately the actual content.*** MichelleRNY, distal, 10/5/94
Ronnie HW~205/SW~191/CW~119/GW~120-115 |
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Duodenal Switch (05/14/08) Member Since: 08/05/07[Latest Posts] | Post Date: 12/2/08 1:32 pm Ronnie, yes that's the thread I had in mind. As I posted to EN earlier, that thread was the reason I literally dumped my UPCal-D down the drain in my kitchen sink and switched to other brands. Thanks for the link! Vicki Has not weighed myself since 1/2010. Letting my clothes gauge my progress instead. |
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 Ludington, MI (08/09/06) Member Since: 06/17/06[Latest Posts] | Post Date: 11/26/08 5:01 am Hey Elizabeth...when you get your D levels back, could you drop me a PM and let me know? I see that your D levels have risen slowly...maybe there's hope for me yet. I had heard that D is slow to tank and slow to bring back up. Mine only went from a 24-25 after two months on 100 k IU. I am hoping that going up to 150 k for a while will at least get me in the 35 range. My doc says that's when they start seeing PTH levels dropping off a bit. thanks! Julie R - Ludington, Michigan Duodenal Switch 08/09/06 - Dr. Paul Kemmeter, Grand Rapids, Michigan HW: 282 - 5'4" SW: 268 GW: 135 CW: 125 |
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Burlington County, NJ Duodenal Switch (12/04/06) Member Since: 11/11/02[Latest Posts] | Post Date: 11/26/08 7:49 am Hey, I'll be so THRILLED when I finally get those levels into a decent range I'll probably take out a flashing ad here on OH to announce it :-p. My PTH levels dropped quite a lot once I crossed into the 30's. |
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 Middle of, TN Duodenal Switch (05/11/09) Member Since: 04/01/08[Latest Posts] | Post Date: 11/25/08 2:15 pm So I'm confused. The NP in your surgeon's office didn't know that you need dry D? That seems . . . odd. Or maybe I misread. Jenn  |
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Duodenal Switch (05/14/08) Member Since: 08/05/07[Latest Posts] | Post Date: 11/26/08 12:09 am Jenn, you read my OP correctly. I don't think that the NP understands the requirements of the dry vitamins due to the malabsorptive properties of our DS plumbing. Vicki Has not weighed myself since 1/2010. Letting my clothes gauge my progress instead. |
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 Hudson, OH Duodenal Switch (03/11/08) Member Since: 02/17/07[Latest Posts] | Post Date: 11/28/08 10:03 am This EXACT situation happened to me last month! My PCP who knows all about my DS and follows another DS post op prescribed the oil based 50k vitamin D for me.... I had the same situation at my pharmacy. Basically the same conversation.... I ended up ordering vitalady's 50k vitamin D and I'm taking it 2X daily (most days) because my D level was a whopping 7. |
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 VA Duodenal Switch (08/09/07) Member Since: 07/23/07[Latest Posts] | Post Date: 11/25/08 2:28 pm Vicki, the same thing happened to me. Dr Elariny's PA prescribed the oil-based crap but I went to VitaLady and started taking her 50k capsules 2 times a day for 30 days; back to 1 - 50k for 30 days, tested...back and forth like that until at 1 year I was at 116 on my labs. Dr Elariny is ecstatic and has told me to follow VitaLady advice on vitamins! WOOT! Gina 5'1" -- HW 195/SW 187/GW 115 July 08/CW 119 Dec 2010 |
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Duodenal Switch (05/14/08) Member Since: 08/05/07[Latest Posts] | Post Date: 11/26/08 12:12 am Gina, great to read of your success with the 50K Vitamin D! Thanks for posting! Vicki Has not weighed myself since 1/2010. Letting my clothes gauge my progress instead. |
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 somewhere Duodenal Switch (02/17/06) Member Since: 03/06/06[Latest Posts] | Post Date: 11/25/08 4:38 pm The Vitalady Tender Iron is the same as the Biotech...she has them relabeled by biotech for her use....and for us to get a discount. (it's a couple of dollars cheaper). I take 100K a day, and have done so for the last year or so. Scott
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Read my blog for more infoDuodenal Switch (05/14/08) Member Since: 08/05/07[Latest Posts] | Post Date: 11/26/08 12:14 am Scott, I am also the type who buys store or generic brand of the national brand. I will be buying Vitalady's brand when I order when I get home from my Thanksgiving holiday. Hope your Vitamin D levels are within the standard range in the past year or so. Thanks for posting! Vicki Has not weighed myself since 1/2010. Letting my clothes gauge my progress instead. |
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Ludington, MI (08/09/06) Member Since: 06/17/06[Latest Posts] | Post Date: 11/25/08 6:29 pm Yup - that's oil form, and not only my DS surgeon, but my endocrinologist as well ordered it for me!!! They just don't get it. As an individual who has developed full-blown osteoporosis as a result of walking around with a low-D level for way too long, and who followed her surgeon's advice about taking D, GET YOURSELF ON 100 k IU A DAY IMMEDIATELY! If your D is a 15 at only six months out, it's likely going to tank big-time at one year to eighteen months. Upping my D from 50 k a day to 100 k a day only brought my D from a 24 to a 25. Mine was at an all-time low of eight before I started taking 50 k IU. I'm now taking at least 150 k IU a day. I'm taking 150 k IU a day of dry, 150 k IU a day of the gel caps (just because they are only $5 for the prescription, and I know I'm absorbing about 18% of the D in them) plus the D I'm getting (if any) from my 5,000 mg of calcium a day. Do this now, before your PTH skyrockets and your serum calcium level drops. A low serum calcium level means it's almost too little too late....by then, you've likely got some significant bone loss going on. Good luck Julie R - Ludington, Michigan Duodenal Switch 08/09/06 - Dr. Paul Kemmeter, Grand Rapids, Michigan HW: 282 - 5'4" SW: 268 GW: 135 CW: 125 |
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Duodenal Switch (05/14/08) Member Since: 08/05/07[Latest Posts] | Post Date: 11/26/08 12:27 am Julie, you're right that not many medical personnel "get it" with our Vitamin D requirements. I am glad that the Vitamin D was drawn; otherwise, I would not have known that I have a very serious deficiency. I will be ordering the 50K when I get home from my Thanksgiving holiday later this week. Thanks for posting! Vicki Has not weighed myself since 1/2010. Letting my clothes gauge my progress instead. |
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 "The OG", OH Duodenal Switch (10/31/05) Member Since: 11/05/04[Latest Posts] | Post Date: 11/26/08 4:42 am The NP, not knowing much about dry D, also isn't aware of how aggressive you need to be. I got as low as 13, and it wasn't until I was taking 50k of dry D daily that my numbers stopped tanking and started moving up. Trust me, I tried all kinds of levels for a year and only tanked further and it's taken me that long to bring them up to close to normal. Don't waste any time with this. Try it daily and retest in a few months. Valerie 1 year to lose the weight - 5 years maintaining it with the DS There is room on this earth for all of God's creatures..next to the mashed potatoes |
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