If a gastric surg is a tool, then why

HI EVERYONE....

If a gastric surgery (any one of them-I had the VSG) which is considered a tool.....which I consider diet pills, or WW or any diet program a tool...then why such a drastic surgical procedure?.  Why after (in my case-8 mo out) the 'honeymoon phase' with the lack of hunger and desire to eat come back and we must diet again or watch what we eat forever?  I was hoping this surgery would take care of the 'calling the name' syndrome.  In other words, the old habits creep back with a vengence....I loved the beginning when I didn't have to worry or think about food just making certain I get in all my nutrients for the rest of my life.

I have slowed down my wt loss and would have never lost this wt without the help of the sleeve, however, now I have to work hard again to lose wt.  Plus I think yo-yo dieting is real again...I started exercising for the last few weeks.

What do you think?  I forgot to ask my surgeon when I was there recently.

alese inFL

The WL phase is supposed to be the time in which you learn and develop the proper disciplines and strategies to a new lifestyle.

No where in any brochures does it say you can eat like you did before surgery.

If your surgeon "sold" you on this being easy and not hard to get to goal and maintain...... than you got flim flamed.....

I will tell you at almost 5 years out I find "Weight Management" much easier than the thought of having to lose 200lbs. pre-surgery.

This is a life-long commitment of compliance.

I eat most everything that is "inside my parameters"...... which is a "VERY SATISFYING" and I don't feel deprived in any way......

Do I like ice cream and cookies better than broccoli ? You bet ...... which means I'm not fixed..... but I can deal with it.....

The good part is you have recognized the situation...... It's up to you to follow through.....

frisco

Frisco! Good to see your post.

How is your maintenance going?

I haven't been on OH for awhile and 

was glad to see an old pal still posting!

 

You are correct in that the surgery is a tool, and only a tool to help folks lose weight.  But I do not think that this tool alone will lead people to success.

Personally I believe that this tool shouldn't be used in isolation to lose and manage weight.  Without behavior modification, I think that this tool will only be moderately effective for most folks.  If a WLS patient doesn't commit to modification of the behaviors that led them to have WLS in the first place, the tool they get won't do what they're hoping it will do.  I believe that one of the keys to my success with this tool so far is participation in a support group that emphasizes behavior modification as a tool for healthy lifestyle change.  This group meets weekly at the hospital where I had my surgery, and I've been going since I had my consult last March.  I honestly don't think I would be where I am now with my weight loss without the cognitive tools, support, and accountability I have gotten from participating in that group.

The above answers are great, and I'll tack on my perspective...

Tools come in different sizes, and have different purposes.  You mention a few alternatives:

Diets - less than 5% success over a 5 year span... effective?  Not really by any measure I know of - AND worse, we end up beating ourselves and doing psychological damage when we fail.  Not the best tool

Pills - hideous side effects

WW - see diets

WLS - The best part of this tool is that you do get a honeymoon phase where hunger is gone, weight loss happens nearly effortlessly for most, and you can get to a healthy weight where you can more easily exercise, and along the way you have time to retrain your habits.  But it is just a tool.  And like any tool, it has it's effective uses and places where it isn't helpful.  Your name will still get called - especially in maintenance.  There are sooo many posts talking about this.  But, the tool really still works, if you use it as intended - get your protein in, stay low carb (for many of us), eat your vegetables... track everything and tweak as needed.  

I can say I'm 20 months out, in Maintenance and the sleeve works perfectly as long as I "operate" the tool correctly.  If I want to mis-use it by eating candy - well, the tool really can't help me then.  That stuff slides right through.  

Unlike diets and pills, the sleeve is always going to be there, waiting for you to use it properly.  

Sure it is "just" a tool, but it is a tool that actually works and gives you a favourable chance at maintaining your weight loss, retraining yourself to eat properly, and the lighter you is more likely to add exercise to your daily activities than the heavier you would have been. 

There is no cure for obesity.  None, zilch, zero.  So far, WLS surgery seems to have the best success rate at putting us into remission, but we aren't cured.

WLS gives you a period of time where you can change your lifestyle, learn new habits, and take care of the pesky emotional crap that's been getting you.  If you use that "honeymoon period" wisely, staying healthy doesn't seem like a diet or a restriction - it seems normal.  And normal people watch their weight too.

I have learned during my honeymoon period that I have food triggers.  One bite and I'm off on a binge and in order to stop have to literally detox myself for a couple of days.  So I avoid those like the plague.  I have learned that dense protein fills me faster and longer than liquid protein.  I have learned that I have a tendency to self-sabotage.  I have learned that I am afraid that if I lose the weight I will no longer have excuses for why I'm single.  

And the sleeve continues to do what it's designed for, even after the honeymoon period.  It will continue to prevent you from eating that large mound of food on your plate and then going back for seconds.  So it's a tool that will last forever - you just have to remember to use it.

Yes, just a tool... but with a huge difference.

The initial 6 weeks post op forces you to stick to phases, and allows your body to completely reset.  This allowed me to deal with the constant cravings of crap food, and it was replaced by craving healthy foods like fish and salad.  The loss of ghrelin is still evident for me and I am over 2 years out- not as much newly sleeved, but still helpful for sure.  If I over due it on carbs though, cravings and hunger come right back.  Restriction is long term as well.  Both of these support maintenance, but yes- one does have to do the work of making good choices.  I still eat crap food- more than I should and more than I am comfortable eating. I will fight the sugar demon for life.  But, I tried every diet out there and nothing worked.  This did.  I am not going to blow it now, because I truly have a second lease on life!

This is funny - I just ran into this article a few hours after reading and replying to your post.... here's why pills are a "bad" tool:

 

From Suppversity.blogspot.com 

"Now You Can Eat All The Crap in The World and Still Lose Weight" Psychological Liberation After Taking a Purported "Fat Burner" is an Overlooked Risk Factor for Obesity

Weight loss pills have potentially obesogenic psychological side effects... Who would have thought that? Well, I did and I bet you will also know someone who is following the "I bought that awesome weight loss pill, now I can eat all the crap in the world and still lose weight" approach to diabesity, right?

I have been waiting for this study to be conducted for years and am by no means surprised that a group of scientists from the Tunghai University and the National Sun Yat-sen University in Taiwan found that "[u]sing weight-loss supplements may produce unintended consequences on 
dietary self-regulation." I mean, don't we all know someone who succumbed to the psychological 
liberation when he or she was using a weight-loss supplement? Yes, we do!  

Is it any wonder that weight loss pills suck, if the experiment Yevvon Y. Chang and Wen-Bin Chiou conducted confirmed what we expected altogether?

After consuming a purported weight loss pill, the 70 young women who had been recruited for the experiment and were randomized to receive a pill of which half of them was told ...

• "the test pill will help you to attain weight loss" - active arm of the study

while the other half was told that the little pills they were supposedly taking in the "Biology Department" and during a functional food test, got the information 

• "the test pill is a placebo that will be used in a future study" - placebo arm

before they were send to a student restaurant for a lunch buffet - the buffet, where the magic happened and the psychologically liberating effect of the weight loss pills took full effect.

"The food in this buffet, which remained consistent over the course of the experiment, consisted of six healthy items (e.g., fruit, salad with Japanese dressing, vegetable pizza, steamed bean cu steamed fish, and sugar-free green tea) and six less healthy items (e.g., chocolate cookies, French fries, fried chicken, cheeseburgers, soda, and custard). Healthy and less healthy items were identified by two nutritionists blind to the purposes of the experiment." (Chang. 2014)

Other than you may have expected, the "heavier" ladies neither ate more, nor less healthy foods. What did have an impact on the number of food items and, more importantly, the type of food (healthy vs. unhealthy) the young women ate was the message the message they'd received, when they had taken the weight loss pill.

Figure 1: Relative differences in total, unhealthy and healthy food intake in subjects who believed that they consumed the weight loss pill; data expressed relative to control group (Chang. 2014)

As you can see in my plot of the study results in Figure 1, the women who had been told that the pill the had taken was an effective fat burner, consumed more food and made unhealthier food choices than the control group who believed they had consumed an ineffective placebo supplement.

Based on a previous analysis of the participants general attitude towards weight loss supplements, the scientists were also able to determine that the "now you can eat all the crap in the world and still lose weight" effect was more pronounced in those young ladies with a positive attitude towards weight loss pills and a firm believe in their efficacy.

NONE of the currently available OTC fat burners will actually "burn" the fat you are to lazy to lose. If you are taking these products to have the occasional slice of pizza every other day, you are doomed to fail. Sales of indulgences like this may work in the confession box, but they don't work on the (body fat) scale.

References:

• Chang, Yevvon Y., and Wen-Bin Chiou. "The Liberating Effect of Weight-Loss Supplements on Dietary Control: A Field Experiment." Nutrition (2014).

   

Speaking only for myself, I asked the same question.  And answered it with the idea that I have tried so many different ways to lose weight over the years, I even have the band right now which I am hoping to replace with the sleeve.

In my case, it is because, even tho I did lose 79 pounds with this band, the total amount of weight I need to lose is so much that I cannot wrap my head around it to see the light at the end of the tunnel.  This "tool" allows a rapid weight loss in the beginning for me so that I CAN see a light at the end of a tunnel.  I CAN see myself in beautiful clothes, looking like I want so much to look but have never been able to.

  It is that light for me.