Denial: It ain't just a river in Egypt

Bah, I tried to paste in the data from the Spring 2008 Jossart and Cirangle Powerpoint presentation showing FOUR YEARS OUT DATA for the VSG, but It won't paste properly.  The presentation (thanks MacMadame) can be found here: http://www.ssat.com/video/2008/SSAT%2049th%20Annual%20Meetin g(3)-Cirangle.htm

Slide 14 has the pertinent data:  I'll just give their data from their own study, because it was what I was looking for, since they have been pushing the VSG for several years now.

Data summarized for a series of 1000 patients -- the largest published -- using the SMALLEST bougie (32f), and at the low end of the average BMI (46), here are their results:

%EWL
Year 1: 68%
Year 2: 68%
Year 3: 62%
Year 4: 47%

Yup, just as has been predicted.

Conclusion:
"The VSG is an acceptable stand-alone procedure for weight loss in lower/moderate BMI patients when compared with other currently available methods"

Interesting conclusion, when you compare to the results shown on slide 24, which shows the VSG %EWL PLUMMETING between years 3-4.  The trend looks scary to me.

The data for starting BMI on slide 25 doesn't make a lot of sense, unless they are referring to data at 1 or 2 years out.  But it clearly SUCKS for people with a starting BMI >55.

I guess that means they are NOT offering it as a stand-alone procedure for high BMIs anymore?  Oh wait -- yes they are.

And DO check out those DS results on slide 24!!

Diana, with all do respect, I do not know why you are over here posting this clip.  MacMadame posted this months ago, and quite frankly, it made me even more convinced that this surgery is for me.  In your argument, you fail to mention that Dr. C mentions, more than once, that they have continued to modify and improve their technique over the past couple of years.  This could absolutely have an effect on the long term outcomes of people who had surgery before said changes.  (+4 yrs)

I think everyone needs to take responsibility to inform themselves on all the procedures and decide on the tool THAT IS BEST FOR THEM.  I also appreciate all the info post-ops share with everyone.  I know it has been very helpful for me.

I guess I am just a little hyper-sensitive since I had my VSG less that 2 weeks ago with Dr. C.  I respect that everyone is very passionate about their surgeries, but I thought you were above starting surgery wars.

It made you even more convinced the surgery was for you?  Really?  You must have seen something in those results that I don't see, and I read scientific and medical publications for a living.

You just had your VSG -- I sure hope your BMI was in the lower/moderate range, since Cirangle had concluded a year ago that that was the only group for whom "acceptable" results could be expected.

If you read scientific and medical publications for a living, I can only assume you are not very good at it.  You have inferred things that were not represented in the presentation.

Yes, it did.  Because I looked at the whole presentation and just didn't cherry-pick info and results to match my point of view.  I looked at the stats, all the stats, and looked at the EWL for patients who had the exact same procedure as me (same size bougie).  I also looked at the recovery time, complication rates, and other long term complications.    Malabsorption was a big concern for me.  Not only for the negative side effects, but also potential problems in the future if I were to need a kidney transplant ( I have PKD).  I considered all the facts.  I came to OH pretty convinced I would go with the band.  I looked at all 4 of the major surgeries, and felt the VSG was the best for me.  I really don't appreciate your insinuation that I made an ill-informed decision and that you are right and I am wrong.  I know what is best for me.  And, BTW, my BMI was 49.  I lost 10 lbs pre-op and have lost 15 lbs in 10 days.  Thanks for asking.

Just a reminder to those of you who may not take the time to watch these slides.

He clearly states that the main reason for such a drop at 4 years is the fact that they started out using a 48 bougie size for the first several years.  They found that using the DS size bougie for VSGs was just too large for long term and adjusted it accordingly.

That is why my husband and I have 32 bougies.  And I would say that is why we lost 100% plus of our excess weight and will most likely continue to keep it off.

And might I add that I think the DS is also a fabulous WLS for those that choose it for their weight loss and lifestyle!

Thank you DianaCox for so nicely coming here and sharing ths information with us.  Not only is he a wonderful and intelligent surgeon but DAMN he is FINE to look at!!

Thanks, Michelle.  That is what I was trying to say.  I just got a little irked at Diana's tone. 

Hijack

I have been caught up in it before too.  I have since learned that it's good if we all love our wls choice, cause that means they are working!

I figure she has every right to post as she wishes and I have every right to do my own research and come to my own conclusions!

Thanks Michelle, did I mention that not only am I 10 days post-op, but I just started my period and have only been off the heparin for a couple of days??  Good Times!  I gotta go make some Crystal Light.  Cheers!!!

exactly, and it isn't a hijack it is completely on -topic.

it's all good!  plus, anyone who doesn't like Diana's or anybody else's posts doesn't have to read them.

I generally enjoy the drama, myself.