DS failure and

Atkins was my very last diet attempt before I got the DS.  I got absolutely no results.  I needed more for my body, and the DS gave it to me.

Honestly Debbie, you never gave your DS a chance to work before you started eating all of the wrong things.  You confess here, we give you some tough love reality checks, and you disappeared.  You didn't want to hear it.  Now that you've seen others pass you by, you're back on the train, but don't dare blame your DS for your lack of success.  That really irritates me.

Val:

First off, I didn't mean to irritate you.  I'm sorry for that.

You are probably right that I didn't give my DS enough of a chance before adding carbs back in, but please know that I certainly was NOT the carbaholic at 5 months out as I have been over the last year or so (since I've been gaining).

Yes, I confessed here and got some tough love.  I can take it, I'm a big girl.  But the reason I "disappeared" (or just stopped posting) is not because I "didn't want to hear it."  It was because I did not think I could do the low carb thing long term and it was yet another failure for me (notice I have not once ever blamed my surgery for failing -- I have taken full blame for my failures).   Do you remember what it was like to fail at diets?  I know you have been at goal for a while now, but do you remember hearing how that felt at all?

Yes, everyone passed me a LONG, LONG time ago.  It's not a new revelation to me at all.  I'm back on the train because I'm afraid of gaining all of my weight back.  It doesn't have a thing to do with others passing me by.

And again Val, please re-read my posts -- I NEVER blamed the surgery failing.  I don't dare do that for two reasons.  One -- I don't blame the surgery for failing.  I blame myself.  And number two, people get "irritated" and somewhat not so nice if you dare say the surgery didn't work.  I don't want people mad at me and quite honestly, I KNOW why my DS didn't work for me (i.e. what I put into my mouth is the problem) ... so I have no clue why I irritate you so much, but I am disheartened at the tone of your letter.  I'm honestly trying to do what I know it is right ... but when you come out accusing me of "disappearing because I didn't wnat to hear it" or accusing me of blaming my surgery for my failure .... I won't lie, it hurts and I don't think it was called for. 

Debbie ~

Debbie, when did you last get nutritional labs done and how did they look?

I don't know about you, but fear of malnutrition, or even diagnosed malnutrition, is what it takes to get through to a lot of people with a DS.

I believe that if you were to make a commitment to being part of a group like this, it would have a positive impact on your life. Some folks are participating in a daily "carb confessional" and say it helps.

You are absolutely right, you must make choices about what you put in your mouth. Do it to live if for no other reason.

I'm due for labs in May.  My past labs have been so-so.  I had to have iron infusions a year ago.  I'm sure iron is down again (feels like it).  D is low as well.  That's about all that was out of sync, thank goodness!

I see the carb confessional.  I don't post there simply because I know my carbs are still likely higher than most (I try to keep mine around 100, but it doesn't always work out that way!).  I know others will just tell me to get it down lower and I guess I am afraid I will get discouraged at the remarks and feel like a failure again.  Does that make sense?  I mean, I'm REALLY trying, but sometimes people make comments that maybe they don't even know how it comes across.

It is very much like it was pre-op for me.  People would say ... "well, why don't you just eat less or exercise more?"  If only it were that simple for me!!!  I would think that anyone who has had WLS would remember what that was like, but some seem to forget and just say things like, "well, why don't you just eat less carbs or exercise more?"  Same statement with a word change or two.

I do like OH and I don't want to be afraid of posting.  I think it is just important for newbies to read about all sides of DS surgery.  Some people get the incentive they need to stay low carb until at goal and they just do it.  Others perhaps are weaker with carbs (like me) and it is still a difficult struggle.  I'm not saying the surgery is bad or that another surgery is better ... but I am saying it sometimes is just as difficult.

I peeked at the scale this morning (tomorrow is my actual weigh-in day) and it looks like I am down 5 lbs.  I'm proud of that ... it's a huge deal for me.

Thanks Elizabeth!

Debbie ~

Hey check it out! Five pounds in just one week? That's enormous!! See, getting connected helps.

You do NOT have to get your carbs under a certain magic number. People talk about 100, or 50 or whatever. But the point is that you do better than what you were doing.

As I said, do it for your health. Change your thinking away from the scale numbers (or clothing sizes) and think about those "so-so" labs and your responsibility to nourish yourself in keeping with your changed gut's needs. Look toward living the rest of your life in good health. You're living with a chronic medical condition; we all are.

How are you doing with supplements? What kind of vitamin D are you taking and how much?

If you don't feel well now, why on  earth wait till May for labs? Go sooner, get a nice complete series done (you can find a good list of DSer labs at www.paclap.com , somewhere in their resources, probably in the downloads/patient info section), and post the results here. Let us all put our heads together and help you feel better.

As for being told to cut your carbs, well....You came here and said you wanted to lose more weight and that you're a DS failure. Naturally we're going to tell you what you can do to turn that around. Remember, we are all in the same boat. I happen to be maintaining effortlessly right now, but I know that could change at any time. If it does, then I'm going to have to make a decision about what I'm willing to change in how I'm eating and living. If the answer is, "Nothing," then I'm going to have to live with the results of those choices.

So, if posting on the carb confessional doesn't appeal to you, find a place to hook in that does appeal. What matters is being connected and accountable. You get that accountability at least to some degree just by participating. It makes you think more about the things you already know you need to do.....like labs and supplements, not just carbs.

I have always been on top of my supplements and I now take 50,000IU dry D a day.

As for why wait for labs -- well, that is where things get complicated.  I have to find new health insurance (I'm self employed).  I have 30 days to find a new plan and have been working feverishly at it (should have answers this week).  Once new plan is established, I will go for some lab work.  There's no doubt my iron has tanked -- I know what that feels like.  I'm exhausted. 

I am keeping track of everything I eat on sparkpeople.  Today is the first day that my carbs are actually in the 80's!!!!  Wooo Hoooo. 

I guess what I meant by being told to "cut carbs" .... I already know that.  Just like pre-surgery, I knew what I "should" do ... but it isn't always so easy.  When I post, instead of being told the obvious (i.e. cut out the carbs) -- I guess I'm looking for tips or ways others have conquered their carb addictions.  Being lectured and flamed is not support, you know what I mean?  I'm not saying you did that by any means, so please don't misunderstand.  :) 

Things like finding Dreamfields pasta and Carbquick baking mix was FANTASTIC for me!!!  It's helping me to learn how to go lower carb and still be able to have the things I love.  I never knew these products existed before!  haha   I am slowly realizing that I can make tweaks in recipes that I love so that I can still have them, but have them in a more low carb way.  That helps me more than mean spiritedness.

I don't think anyone is being mean spirited with you. But you'll have to be here for a while before you can see their good intentions. As you can see, I'm very, very blunt and direct, and this bothers plenty of people. Not everyone "clicks," online as in real life.

I hope that as you participate more here, you'll see that we're all in the same boat. We all know what the bugaboos are. We've all been there, done that, and for the most part have found ways to make this work. If people come here and clearly are NOT working at making things work, but still want to complain, then yeah, they're going to get a bunch of tough love, and I'm going to be first in line administering same. The goal is not perfection. It's improvement. We all know that.


You're going to be fine. I bet in a couple of months you're going to feel a lot better.

Bummer about the insurance. I can't tell you how grateful I am for Tricare. It's well worth the 20 years DH spent in the Army.

Have you tried Vitalady's Tender Iron by any chance? Or are you just one of these folks who doesn't absorb iron through the gut? I'm praying I don't go that route. So far, so good. My iron has been nice and stable, possibly partly because I donated the lady parts to science and thus quit bleeding like a stuck pig all the time....

I don't mind blunt and I honestly don't mind being called out if I were simply blaming the surgery for not working and not trying to do what is right too.  I wi**** were easier for me, but that's life.  Sometimes it doesn't seem fair ... but oh well!  lol

I like how you put things -- the goal isn't perfection, but rather improvement.  That makes things more "doable" for me.  I'm the "all or nothing" type of personality, but putting things in perspective (i.e. aiming for improvement rather than perfection) is really helpful.

I have tried Tender Iron with little improvement.  I have prescription iron now and still not much of a change.  The only thing that has helped has been the infusions.  My hematologist is recommending I too lose my lady parts and thus stop the monthly blood letting!  haha  I am giving serious thought to that ... but to be honest ... 2 surgeries in 3 years is enough and I'm just not ready to go through another (I know a hysterectomy is not nearly as bad as two open surgeries, but ..... I'm a wimp!). 

I do appreciate your candor and I will hang around here for a while picking up tips and hints.  Not sure how much I will post ... but if I feel I have something to add, I will add it.  Hopefully as my low carbing gains momentum, I will be able to help other carbaholics to cut back and make improvements in their diet with some of my own tips and tricks!

Debbie ~

Oh trust me, a hysterectomy is just as bad as any other abdominal/pelvic surgery and well worth considering VERY carefully. Have you considered an endometrial ablation to reduce/eliminate Mother Nature? It might really be a good idea if you're fighting intractible anemia.

Sounds like you're one of the folks who just doesn't really absorb iron through the gut any more. That blows. Perhaps you've noticed there are quite a few people here with that issue.

There's a great example of a subject where you could "safely" participate in the forum! You'd be surprised how much influence the voice of "yet another" person who's BTDT can have on someone who's deeply distressed by finding themselves in that position. You have many other things to share, too. How about just talking to newbies about your surgery/recovery experience?

My reason for encouraging you to post/participate is that I find when I stay active here, as in any support group, that I do better for myself all the way around. Sharing my story and talking to people keeps me thinking about what I can do for my own benefit. I hope you might find it beneficial to do that, too.

her surgeon has on this site listed 230 RNY, 10 DS

he has the following doctors listed as training with, do any of these sound like familiar DS surgeons

Medical School:	Christian Medical College – Vellore, India (graduated 1986)
Additional Education:	testing
Residency:	New York Medical College/Our lady of Mercy – Bronx, NY (finished 2003)
Fellowship:	New York Medical College – Valhalla, NY (finished 2004)

Specialized Training:

Name:	Dr. M Rangaraj
Date:	07/03-06/04
Training Covered:	Laparoscopy, Bariatric Surgery
Name:	Dr. L Maffucci
Date:	07/03-06/04
Training Covered:	Laparoscopy, Bariatric Surgery
Name:	Dr. A Kaul
Date:	07/03-06/04
Training Covered:	Laparoscopy, Bariatric Surgery
Name:	Dr. T Cerabona
Date:	07/03-06/04
Training Covered:	Laparoscopy, Bariatric Surgery

 Personally I would be going to a skilled DS revision surgeon. It may be that she needs a smaller stomach, a shorted CC or just to eat Atkin's style/lo carb.  One reason I did an open DS was to get my intestine measured and to use the Hess method where the CC is a percentage of your overall intestinal length.