Don't forget your carbs

So for the first 90 days after going on a 500 calorie diet, there was an increase in strength but no appreciable difference in weight loss. Cool, I'll buy that. Ain't no question in my mind that diet plays a more important role in weight loss than exercise especially during the initial periods of massive weight loss. I've said that numerous times here in the locker room.

On the other hand, I wonder what happened to the same MO women after 90/180/360+ days after the caloric intake increases? I'm pretty confident that the subjects who were able to continue building muscle and endurance experienced greater weight loss in the first year than those who didn't. I'm also confident that those who exercise were able to maintain the weight loss over the long haul.

We ain't just talkin' about 90 days here, we're talkin' a life time commitment to lose the weight and keep it off. Thus, the longer term benefit of exercise and why it's so critical especially for us who were MO.

The ability for us WLSers to control our eating over the long haul (> 1 year) is spotty at best imo. There are the fortunate few who can control their eating but I believe the vast majority of us WLSers will up the caloric intake to a point where weight gain is inevitable. I believe commonly stated WLS statistics of >80% of WLSers experience weight regain support this statement. Statistics also indicate that those WLSers who exercise are best able to avoid significant weight regain.    

Bottom line, develop the exercise habits in the first year post-WLS and continue them for the rest of your life. Don't exercise then risk going back to the dark days of MO.

Boner

"We ain't just talkin' about 90 days here, we're talkin' a life time commitment to lose the weight and keep it off. Thus, the longer term benefit of exercise and why it's so critical especially for us who were MO."

We are also talking about longer than six months. This is one study of many that you can look at to include long term.

I completely understand that habits need to be established in the first year. I understand there all kinds of benefits associated with exercise. I understand that exercise is necessary for long term success. Since that is not quite what we are talking about here, if you are interested in seeing additional research on your own you can take a look at the following book:

http://www.amazon.com/Physical-Activity-Obesity-Claude-Bouch ard/dp/0880119098

The study you referenced was a 90 day look at weight loss thus my comment. Quite frankly, I could give a rats ass about the short-term impact of exercise on weight loss and neither should you imo.

To have you communicating the message that "exercise doesn't result in weight loss" is counter productive even though it may be "intellectually correct" for the first several months after WLS. Why pray tell, would you tell a WLS support group in Houston that "exercise doesn't result in weight loss?"  Confusing message to be sending to a bunch of WLSers who are in this weight loss and maintenance thing for the long haul.

I be thinkin' that as the fitness expert here on OH, you should be espousing the importance of exercise as you stated:

"I completely understand that habits need to be established in the first year.
I understand there all kinds of benefits associated with exercise.
I understand that exercise is necessary for long term success."

Just my thoughts

Boner

  

Don't worry, I do espouse that information on a daily basis but again, the numerous health related aspects of exercise were not the focus of the original discussion. So, since we can't seem to stay on topic and discuss a single issue without you telling me what I should be doing on a professional level, I will leave you to your own thoughts on the issue.

Huh? I believe this was the original topic between the Counselor and me, Jeremy. I couldn't believe there was no significant weight loss for up to 2 years after WLS for those that exercise and those that didn't . I still don't but you've convinced me that there is for the first 90 days. Great. 

More important to me was my dismay at the Counselor's original post way back when which I interpreted to say "Jeremy says we don't need to exercise." After reading your responses here, I can see how a WLSer could be confused by your mixed messages. 

Interpret my comments any way you feel. I was only trying to get to the bottom of some comments which I felt were counter productive to the message that exercise in mandatory for WLSers who wish to maintain their weight loss. 

Boner

  

It is pretty clear that I state it is important for long term maintenance. But long term maintenance and actually causing weight loss are two very important and different things. This is even stated in the post that you quoted me from on the Exercise board.

And I don't quite understand how you misinterpreted this when it clearly says, "Gentles emphasized to us, though, that this result doesn't mean that WLSers should give up on the idea of exercise during their honeymoon period, as it is still important for maintaining weight loss, lean body tissue, and for the usual cardiovascular beneits of same."

There was another thread well before this one in which the Counselor first broached the "don't need to exercise" topic. I asked him for the DS research you referenced which he was unable to provide. He brought it up again in this thread. 

"But long term maintenance and actually causing weight loss are two very important and different things." Do you think an early-out WLSer really understands this distinction? I don't think so based upon my personal experience. It's all about how fast and how much weight I can lose with the least amount of effort (i.e. exercise). But hey, I may be different.  
 
Why did you even frickin' bring it up in the first place is my point. Seems counter productive to me but hey.........

I'm done.

Boner

"Do you think an early-out WLSer really understands this distinction? I don't think so based upon my personal experience."

Many don't and that is kind of the point...they need to because so many set weight loss as their primary goal through exercise. If people do have a better understanding of these concepts, it may help them set proper goals initially when it comes to  exercise.

Here are a couple of the examples I see on a dialy basis as I am sure you do as well.

"I am 5 months post-op and I have hit a plateau. I started an exercise program 4 weeks ago and my weight has not moved at all. I am getting really frustrated and thinking about quiting"

or

"I am 20 pounds from goal, I have been exercising for 6 weeks and my weight is not budging"

These kinds of statements are counterproductive and avoidable.

If people fail yet another time because they have set the wrong goal(s) initially, their chances of successfully participating in an exercise program in the future is dramatically reduced. Sure we need to talk about diet amongst other things to get people back on track but proper goal setting for exercise should be included. 

Ithas been shown time and time again that proper goal setting is a must and in order to set proper goals, you need to know what is proper and what is not. A part of this means explaining why weight loss through exercise is generally not a reasonable goal and yes this means painting a clear picture of the differences between initial weight loss and long term maintenance.

That is why I bring it up in the first place.

Jeremy,

By the way, did Ron Lester ask you or any of the OH powers-to-be about:
 
1. The men's forum getting listed on main OH forums pull down list so wayward WLS men can more easily know the locker room exists.

2. A sticky note letting women know this is a mens forum and we would appreciate them respecting our desire to keep it that way.

3. Changing our logo  to something more inspirational / relevant

Boner

I am personally not aware of anything from Ron Lester.