I guess I am not very smart....

If your god is ALL POWERFUL, he can overcome evil and the devil to spare so much suffering.

If your god chooses NOT to do that, then he is malevolent.

So much for the omnipotent, all-loving and just deity.

Draz, I'm quite sure that those of us from the R&R board are the only ones here who have heard of Post-Holocaust theology.  It tries to answer- or at least allow for- the types of questions that have been raised here.  Since it takes SO much discussion to understand, I would suggest that anyone interested simply do a Google search on the topic.  All major world religions have been struggling with this for decades now...no surprise that Judaism's best minds have been turned to the topic.

I have my own beliefs on many issues in religion, and I generally don't agree with the mainstream.  What I feel on this topic is pretty simple.  I believe that God created man to live in community, not in isolation.  Our strongest and purest experiences of Him come from His own love, filtered through the fallible, frail mortals who we deal with on our journey.  From this viewpoint, God WAS present during the Holocaust.  He was present in every person who sheltered a Jew, or who showed a kindness to those who were persecuted.  He was present in every act of bravery, no matter how small.  He was present in the tears of both the Jews who were being slaughtered, and the Gentiles who had waited too long to stop the insanity.  I believe that one of the highest purposes we can have on this earth is to ease the suffering of others...that we were created to care for one another.  I also believe that this was shown by the incarnation, suffering and death of Jesus.  I call myself a Christian not because I follow the doctrine of any church, but because I do try to follow the example of Jesus himself.

Flame away.  Have this post "moderated".  Call me a demon and cast me out from this board.  After all, I AM one of the mean smart people, right? 

Linda, I have heard this argument before, and I must admit I have questions about it.   How does it work in terms of babies suffering from cancer, or innocent children killed by tornados, or children born with painful and debilitating birth defects?  I can understand the mistakes and crimes of adults coming back to bite them, but I can't understand the suffering of infants and children.  They have not sinned against anyone and they have not had the chance to accept god into their hearts, or even understand the concept of god. 

It is this kind of suffering, that of the truly innocent, that I have never been able to grasp in the context of an all loving, all powerful god.  Can you help me understand?

Well, for one I'll say I beg you not to pray for me.  If all of your mythology happens to be real I'd rather go to hell than be a sheeple who keeps putting off real life because they are so convinced (for no actual rational reason) that someone will come and save them and they'll see all their loved ones on some clouds somewhere.

Carmen!! Don't ever apologize for stating your case!  I completely agree with you. The turnout alone at the polls gave me hope that people DO CARE about our country. I think this is just the after math, mixed with the unknown and packaged up in fear!!

If anyone believes in Divine Providence then they stand on the fact that God is in control, right?  Even if you don't believe that, I have always liked the quote "The only constant is change!"   Thank goodness we have change. Otherwise life becomes stagnant and boring.

I think what you might be seeing/hearing is like a pimple.  It grows, becomes sore, hurts,pops, oozes, then heals. You are just seeing all the ooze before the heal.

Love ya, Nanci

Carmen,
I totally agree with you.I didn't vote yesterday but I did pray that whoever was put in office it was God's Will and He DID just that.I am not upset about who runs our country because I know He is in control and will always be.We just Pray to God to let Obama run this country as God sees fit.Unity is what this country needs in this present time.We just need to pray all the hatred goes away and Peace to be in our hearts as You and I are at Peace with God in my heart.
Hope You flush out all the negativity as I have and Have a Blessed rest of the day!


Spoken With God's Amazing Love,
Brandy 

I agree Carmen. If you live in this country then you need to support it whether you agree with the leader**** My candidate didn't win but I realize that it doesn't matter if I agree with our new president or not. I'm part of this country and will pray for the leaders as they face some very trying days ahead. I would not want to be in their shoes. And like you, my faith is what I stand on. The Lord has never let me down even though people have and will. I don't understand the hate either. It only hurts the hater. I hope that when I die, people will be able to say good things about me. As a matter of fact, I hope they say that about me now.

Love,
DebbieDoo

I agree Carmen.  My children asked me this morning who won and I told them.  I said Obama is a nice person.  We may not have the same views on some things, but I know he will take care of our/his country.  My youngest son went out the front door saying I am glad Obama is president.  God is in control no matter who wins.  The color of your skin doesn't matter it is what is in  your heart.  I told my kids to just pray and ask God to lead Obama in the right direction just as I would if McCain had won. 

I love ya,
Linda

(((MOMMA))))

Just remember what you told me the other day... 16 years ago Clinton was voted into office.
We made it through all of that!
GOD IS PRESENT!
We know he is in complete control.. and while we want to share him with everyone we meet and let them feel the love we feel it is their choice!
Jesus paid the price for our sins. All they have to do is pray and if they want us to pray with them or for them we will!!
I love you Momma!!!

Like Nanci said we will all heal and this country will come together.

Carmen, Please do not think that you have to feel that you need to appologize for your feelings.  You have the right to have feels as well as voice your opinions!

As for those who dont want to hear all this "Jesus" stuff hit the darn back button and go BACK to where ever you came from.  Apparently you arent part of this Bama Family so maybe just maybe you need to go back to your own little world and leave ours alone.  Nothing you will say or  have said will change those of us who believe in the Lord God Almighty minds!  Poof Be Gone!