Cross Addicting

Now that we have had another person succumb to the horrible problem of cross addicting to something other than food I feel like it would be good to step up and have a discussion about this.

I feel that I have said my piece in the thread about Jess but to get it off the ground,

My name is Fred and I am an Alcoholic...

Hi Fred!

There aren't words for the sadness that losing another member of our tribe brings about to all she loved and touched. We're all angry and sad, and deeply mourning a senseless loss. I am not the cheerleader I once was for this surgery - simply because people are being cleared for surgery and then set out to wander without the support they deserve and need to live.

At Renewal, I know I was a weirdo - because I wanted to talk about our shared addiction to food. Because I would continually bring up the fact that this surgery was to save my life, and wanted to talk about healing from my addiction to food one day at a time I got a lot of crap from people who didn't want to hear it. I'm almost 6 years out from my RNY, and have seen so many beautiful souls tortured by cross addiction. I had the gift of the 12 steps in my life, and I cleaved to them with all my might through this journey. I'm experiencing survivor's guilt even as I am grateful for my own continued survival.

Without support (therapy, support groups with ACTUAL healing, not just protein tips, and a lot of growth) we are all in danger of cross addicting. The fact of the matter is, surgeons are rerouting our stomachs & intestines to create the perfect alcoholics and what takes others 20 years to achieve takes us just a couple years - death. I'm sick of losing my friends. I'm tired of seeing people I love lose their houses due to gambling addictions. I'm deeply sad at how many friends have lost their primary relationships due to sexual addiction. We deserve what we sought by having this surgery - a long healthy life. I want my friends healthy and whole.

My sister is preparing for a RNY gastric bypass - just like I had. She got the family Diabetes right on schedule at 35, and it is already becoming debilitating and insulin resistant (just like what killed our mother). As much as I'm proud of her for choosing life, I'm terrified that I could lose her to cross addiction. We get this surgery, and we stop talking to each other. People get so judgemental about who's lost more weight, or regained - instead of owning the truth of our struggle. We have to love and support each other - our lives are at stake.

With deepest love and respect for all, wherever you are on your journey with WLS,
~Lara

Hi Lara,

IMO, the surgeons and boards do not effectively address the issue of cross addiction.  We are given the physical tools to not eat as much as we once did but it does not address the psychological nature of why we ate so much.  It becomes a great big target for us to easily hit.

I can list the reasons why I over ate.  Bad marriage, crappy relationships outside of my family and an overall distress at my situation.  I can also list the reasons that I started drinking to excess too. Bad marriage, crappy relationships outside of my family and an overall distress at my situation.  Self esteem has a lot to do with it. 

With that being said, the behaviors around each issue were the same.  The result was going to be the same too, death.

I sought out my reasons for wanting the surgery.  I also sought out my reasons for wanting sobriety.  My recovery required a spiritual change, not just a behavorial change.  I am not expecting anyone who has an addiction to understand my recovery as everybody has their own recovery through this process.

The difference between my RNY and my alcoholism is that I was given tools for life in dealing with the alcoholism.  Not so much with the surgery.

Doing the right things for all the wrong reasons still makes it the wrong thing to do.  Everyone should be taking a moment to reflect on where they are, what they are doing and perhaps how it is affecting everyone around them.

Just my $0.02,

Fred

Hi Fred, and everyone on the board...

 I don't know if you remember me... I rarely post.. I had my surgery 5 years ago.  

I lost alot.. and..gained it all back.  

See.. I agree with you Fred.. The surgeons to me don't deal with the issue of cross addictions.. or any addictions.   When I went back in, it was prior to my back fusion.  I was popping narcotics like crazy to keep the pain down for that, hoping that the surgeon could help me understand why I was able to eat so much more.. Did I fail?  Did I stretch out the stoma? Could I get a revision?  They looked at me and said, "What do you want me to do.. we gave you the tool, just use it.." 

It for me was during that time I started also casual drinking...  the doctors were taking me off of narcotics, debating the need, however the pain was great in my back.. so I'd have a drink here or there to take care of it.  A..  "Quick Fix.."  

My back since has been fixed.  I still drank once in a while... stress was great for me.  We've moved out of Minnesota.  It wasn't until I heard about Jess... that struck me to the core.  I'm done.

I think surgeons need to take that time, not just one psych visit and a paper test.  That wasn't enough.  I should of never been approved for it.. Or if I was, it was with addiction counseling after wards.   I feel like the system failed.. I feel like I've failed.  I'm seeing a doctor now who is working with me step by step to recover. 

If anyone is going to have this surgery... know this...  It's not a quick fix.  If you don't address your addictions, you will have to face them again.  One way or another..

Hi Fred and Lara! 

Thank you for posting about this.  It is so hard to realize and admit addiction.  Being "fat" is somewhat accepted by society, but being an addict is not.  I never realized how easy the transfer addiction could happen.  I was a responsible, social/light drinker until age 40. About a year after surgery when I had my first glass of wine, it all snowballed.  Suddenly a feew months later, I was a drunk!  I've tried a few "responsible drinking" experiments since then, but the bottom line is I went from being a full-blown food addict to a full-blown alcoholic in no time flat!  I've come to realize that most of us who become morbidly obese are addicts, although I won't take anyone's inventory.  People who just "like to eat" are 20 or so pounds overweight, not 100+ overweight like those of us who have had surgery. 

I'm thankful that I've always had some people around me in recovery so I knew about the 12 step programs.  I've gone between OA and AA meetings, and feel at home at either one, but probably more so at OA because the food addiction came first and if I follow a food plan, it takes care of the alcohol because I haven't yet heard of an OA food plan with alcohol on it.

I didn't meet Jess, but certainly saw her on the boards.  I had no idea that she had addictions also.  I wish I had reached out to her.  A young mother, with a beautiful son - what a tragic loss.  And what a horrible reminder of how insidious addiction is.  Thank you for drawing attention to this life-saving issue. 

Hi Renee,

There are other problems when addressing an addiction.  First and foremost, there is the whole denial issue.  Many of us knew of Jess's situation well before she was able to even think about it.  Reaching out to her would have ended in the same denial.   But as you know, addicts will not do something about their situation until they reach rock bottom.  Hopefully we can reach it before it kills us.

With that said, I miss Jess.  I feel bad for her child as he will not know the joy that was his mother.  I am angry at Jess for doing this to herself.  And sad that the end was so complete.

Fred

I'm so sorry for your loss, and the rest of those who knew and loved her.

Dearest Fred (my favorite big brother),

I am deeply grateful that you heard my words that said "You can't possibly sit there and tell me that you're drinking like that and not actively trying to kill yourself".  I don't think that had I said anything else that I would have been much of a friend to you.  My love for you is fiercely protective - of your life, not your secrets.  I want you alive, I'm selfish that way.  I don't care who likes or dislikes the truth. The fact is: we can't drink as a post-op as we did b4 surgery. It is like playing russian roulette, with an M-16.  And anyone who encourages you to go against your surgeon's warnings about Alcohol isn't much of a friend. Any surgeon who doesn't stress Cross Addiction to us as a real and present danger to our lives - shouldn't be cutting into us in the 1st place. 

I thank God every single day that I have you in my life, and that you are safe and sober one day at a time.  I wish for nothing less than that for all of my friends.  Even and especially if they don't want it for themselves. 

This surgery is supposed to grant us the ability to have a long healthy life, not rob us of our future.  My heart is broken for all who lose their battle with cross addiction.  And I am deeply sorry to hear that other people have experienced "friends" walking away from them simply because they admitted their frailty and struggle to them.  I've lost "friends" because I wouldn't encourage post-op binge drinking - and frankly I am scared every single day for the lives of these people.  I love my friends enough to tell them the truth - even at the risk of them walking away from me.  

With all my heart,
~LilBro

This all was quite a wake up call for me.  I started seeing a therapist about 4 months ago because I was drinking more than I was comfortable with.  Before surgery, I rarely drank during the week and only sometimes on the weekends - very light drinker.  I couldn't figure out why I was drinking every day and more and more as time went on.  I realized that I never got a hangover and my body didn't tell me to "stop, I've had enough".  I did some googling and discovered that there are a lot of people like me - never much of a drinker but something changed physically and emotionally after surgery.  I don't think it is as simple as a cross addiction - I really think there is a physiological component as well. 

After the wake up calls lately with people on OH and elsewhere, I decided that enough was enough.  I have enough issues in my life and don't need to add chronic alcohol abuser to the list.  My husband and I had a talk about this the other day - he had been right in there with me, drinking every night.  We agreed that it is best to lay off it for a bit and kick that behavior before we find ourselves with a major problem. 

This was a very difficult post for me to write.  I was really feeling like there was something weak or wrong with me.  I now realize that my body and mind have to work towards a healthy life, not towards an equally or even more unhealthy life.  I have control over all of this and am taking it back. 

Thanks for listening
Amelia